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GoldHP
Joined: 09 Jul 2005
Posts: 4135
Location: Penis |
Minus turtleman you canadians are pertty damn smart...
The us is stupid for not doing this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9INY7XWKujE
and I GIVE props to canada now.
ps I love you ~tmang!
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care factor: 0
Forget calling Jon a virgin, that would be too nice since he never even touched a girl + he is the biggest faggot ov all time.
Originally posted by EQ
im not really good in english but this song see like really wack..
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Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:41 pm |
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GoldHP
Joined: 09 Jul 2005
Posts: 4135
Location: Penis |
quote:
Originally posted by Jon;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=m2AkxPCxt_A
jews, in canada?
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care factor: 0
Forget calling Jon a virgin, that would be too nice since he never even touched a girl + he is the biggest faggot ov all time.
Originally posted by EQ
im not really good in english but this song see like really wack..
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 11:25 am |
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smurf_king
Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 4366
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we have polymer bills since 8 years ago here in Mexico
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 12:06 pm |
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GoldHP
Joined: 09 Jul 2005
Posts: 4135
Location: Penis |
quote:
Originally posted by smurf_king
we have polymer bills since 8 years ago here in Mexico
amazing that the US can spend all this money but they can't make a damn dollar that can't be counterfeited.
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care factor: 0
Forget calling Jon a virgin, that would be too nice since he never even touched a girl + he is the biggest faggot ov all time.
Originally posted by EQ
im not really good in english but this song see like really wack..
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 3:22 pm |
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GaNzTheLegend
Joined: 01 Jan 2001
Posts: 8287
Location: Toronto, Canada |
The federal reserve is one big counterfeiting machine.
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 6:03 pm |
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hassan-i-sabbah
Joined: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 27424
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quote:
Originally posted by GaNzTheLegend
The federal reserve is one big counterfeiting machine.
if money isn't somebody with power arbitrarily declaring certain objects to be currency by fiat then what the fuck is it
do you actually think gold has some kind of intrinsic value or something
rofl
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quote:
Originally posted by turtleman
A normal person wouldn't say that in real life because it's ridiculous and insulting. Yet here you are spouting the most hateful garbage that your demons can muster out of your darkened soul. All because of the internet.
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 6:40 pm |
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RamJam
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 1840
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Funny that there's people who think dollars should be backed by gold too.
A useless tangible item declared to be a currency by powerful people backed by another useless tangible item declared to be a currency by powerful people.
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 8:50 pm |
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The_G0D
Joined: 09 Oct 2007
Posts: 4488
Location: New Zealand & Australia |
quote:
Originally posted by RamJam
Funny that there's people who think dollars should be backed by gold too.
A useless tangible item declared to be a currency by powerful people backed by another useless tangible item declared to be a currency by powerful people.
so is cash?
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<[TD]ViRuZ> You have balls...I like balls
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 9:42 pm |
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RamJam
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 1840
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not trolling you are just dumb
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 10:34 pm |
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swift0ne
Joined: 22 Mar 2011
Posts: 1426
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quote:
Originally posted by RamJam
Funny that there's people who think dollars should be backed by gold too.
A useless tangible item declared to be a currency by powerful people backed by another useless tangible item declared to be a currency by powerful people.
What do you think it should be backed by (if anything)?
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 11:17 pm |
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swift0ne
Joined: 22 Mar 2011
Posts: 1426
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quote:
Originally posted by Lightbringer-
For anything to have value, it should be limited in supply and be accepted as currency or legal tender if you want.
Fascinating. You should write this shit down.
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 11:27 pm |
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RamJam
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 1840
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idk if that was a joke lightbringer but using paper currency is fine and is much more efficient than bartering.
I think the point of my post was missed. I was poking fun at the fact that a lot of people want the dollar backed by gold as if it has some intrinsic value and a stable world market price when in reality gold is just a useless item that was arbitrarily deemed as currency centuries ago (just like the dollar) and actually has price volatility against foreign currency that is historically much higher than the dollar.
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 11:33 pm |
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RamJam
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 1840
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quote:
Originally posted by swift0ne
What do you think it should be backed by (if anything)?
Nothing, just the expectation that people will still value it in the future. Backing a currency by another volatile asset with no intrinsic value doesn't necessarily make it any safer.
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 11:39 pm |
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swift0ne
Joined: 22 Mar 2011
Posts: 1426
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So you're saying gold is equivalent to a valueless dollar, or basically equal to that (now) random piece of paper in a crashed economy? Are you sure if the US Market crashed completely and the dollar became useless that I wouldn't be able to trade my imaginary gold to someone of means for things I wanted, even If I had to trade outside of the country and got less value per ounce then I would have gotten pre-crash?
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Wed Nov 02, 2011 11:49 pm |
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RamJam
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 1840
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There were like 3 pages in another thread about the value of gold in a"financial apocalypse." I don't feel like talking about it again.
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Thu Nov 03, 2011 12:04 am |
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RamJam
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 1840
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Some economists suggest that barring a domestic financial collapse (with international markets still intact) that an emergency procedure could be used to back the currency by gold. I wouldn't be totally opposed to this idea, but it would only be used as move of desperation. The chances of the U.S. markets collapsing without the international markets collapsing are incredibly low though. As they currently are there's absolutely no reason to have the dollar backed by gold.
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Thu Nov 03, 2011 12:25 am |
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swift0ne
Joined: 22 Mar 2011
Posts: 1426
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A simple yes or no is adequate. Not looking to disagree, just curious on your stance in particular. You seem a little less static in your opinions compared to a lot of the posters on here, so I was curious what you thought.
I want to read that thread!
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Thu Nov 03, 2011 12:27 am |
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RamJam
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 1840
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Well there's usually no simple answers when you are talking about economics. People who use the same exact ideology in every situation are usually just stubborn.
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Thu Nov 03, 2011 12:53 am |
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swift0ne
Joined: 22 Mar 2011
Posts: 1426
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That applied to your previous post, and I realize the answer would be longer with explanation, but I didn't really expect more than just a Y/N.
Though maybe it's use is to be a reassurance for the blind, and so the world goes on. Maybe Believing in unreasonable perceptions to be objective, solid or fair still allows the masses to operate in just about every manner, not just fiat money backed by some gold standard. Perception might succeed or at least heavily influence human reasoning in countless matters.
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Thu Nov 03, 2011 1:29 am |
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RamJam
Joined: 26 Nov 2010
Posts: 1840
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quote:
Originally posted by Lightbringer-
One thing. Currency without any backing by something, whatever reserve it is serves as a check to keep the value of money.
I don't agree with this at all. The value of a currency is dependent on the underlying economy and governments that adopts the currency, not what underlying assets are backed by the currency. It's not like following a complete financial failure a government is just going to give up its entire gold supply anyways, and limiting a nation's purchasing power based on how much "gold" a nation has will just create a deadweight loss on the economy.
A strong monetary policy and economy keep the value of money, not gold.
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Thu Nov 03, 2011 3:37 am |
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smurf_king
Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 4366
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Gold is the most stable currency now, it is, has been for milleniums, and will continue to be. Whoever says otherwise is stupidly informed.
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Thu Nov 03, 2011 4:15 am |
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GaNzTheLegend
Joined: 01 Jan 2001
Posts: 8287
Location: Toronto, Canada |
quote:
Originally posted by hassan-i-sabbah
if money isn't somebody with power arbitrarily declaring certain objects to be currency by fiat then what the fuck is it
do you actually think gold has some kind of intrinsic value or something
rofl
I can't believe you are this dumb. Its like saying oil, a limited resource has no value. Of course gold has value. Its very rare and is used in every CPU in the world, not to mention almost every sophisticated electronic device in the world think cell phones, gps systems, calculators, etc etc. It has extremely beneficial properties. Same with silver btw.
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Thu Nov 03, 2011 7:14 am |
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Kith-Kanin
Joined: 15 Sep 2000
Posts: 4449
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quote:
Originally posted by GaNzTheLegend
quote:
Originally posted by hassan-i-sabbah
if money isn't somebody with power arbitrarily declaring certain objects to be currency by fiat then what the fuck is it
do you actually think gold has some kind of intrinsic value or something
rofl
I can't believe you are this dumb. Its like saying oil, a limited resource has no value. Of course gold has value. Its very rare and is used in every CPU in the world, not to mention almost every sophisticated electronic device in the world think cell phones, gps systems, calculators, etc etc. It has extremely beneficial properties. Same with silver btw.
In today's society it has intrinsic value, but it's not a necessity of life, like food, water, shelter etc.
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Thu Nov 03, 2011 7:22 am |
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hassan-i-sabbah
Joined: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 27424
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quote:
Originally posted by Lightbringer-
He thinks bartering should be the standard.
For anything to have value, it should be limited in supply and be accepted as currency or legal tender if you want. Else, we are back to the stone age with bartering.
lol this is a historical myth. credit systems and coinage both predate "barter economies," which have never been shown to be in practice in ancient times or among less developed peoples. in fact the only known instances of widespread barter economies are circumstances in which people used to commercial money economies suddenly have to make do without money (like prison or hyper-inflation era weimar germany)
quote:
Originally posted by GaNzTheLegend
I can't believe you are this dumb. Its like saying oil, a limited resource has no value. Of course gold has value. Its very rare and is used in every CPU in the world, not to mention almost every sophisticated electronic device in the world think cell phones, gps systems, calculators, etc etc. It has extremely beneficial properties. Same with silver btw.
but there's nothing about gold that makes it better as a measure of value than wheat, oil, marbles, dollars, or anything else
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quote:
Originally posted by turtleman
A normal person wouldn't say that in real life because it's ridiculous and insulting. Yet here you are spouting the most hateful garbage that your demons can muster out of your darkened soul. All because of the internet.
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Thu Nov 03, 2011 8:58 am |
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hassan-i-sabbah
Joined: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 27424
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quote:
Originally posted by RamJam
I don't agree with this at all. The value of a currency is dependent on the underlying economy and governments that adopts the currency, not what underlying assets are backed by the currency. It's not like following a complete financial failure a government is just going to give up its entire gold supply anyways, and limiting a nation's purchasing power based on how much "gold" a nation has will just create a deadweight loss on the economy.
A strong monetary policy and economy keep the value of money, not gold.
at the end of the day the value of a currency, whether it's gold or dollars, depends on faith in the issuer to make good on their debts. so if i'm a country and i buy a billion dollars worth of US treasuries, the expectation is that eventually the US will pay me back a billion dollars. of course, this is farcical, because if the US actually did pay all its debt, the economy would basically collapse. the only thing, in my opinion, keeping the world economic system together and making people continue to buy into this system (since they mostly lose out, due to the arcane magic of interest rate manipulation that allows these streams of capital into the US to function very much like old fashioned imperial tribute) is the same thing that's always kept markets and economies functioning since they first started: naked military force
i just finished this book, ya'll should read it if you're into like economic history and shit http://www.amazon.com/Debt-First-5-000-Years/dp/1933633867
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quote:
Originally posted by turtleman
A normal person wouldn't say that in real life because it's ridiculous and insulting. Yet here you are spouting the most hateful garbage that your demons can muster out of your darkened soul. All because of the internet.
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Thu Nov 03, 2011 9:17 am |
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